TATV

[ShannaG]

Tonight I'll be a guest on Trek.fm's "The Ready Room" show as we discuss TATV. I think they'll be posting it to their site on Monday. I'll be back with a link and other information when I have it. I sure hope you'll all tune in!

[EntAllat]

That's awesome! Do you know what time that'll be? I'll try to tune in.

[ShannaG]

I just finished recording. Man, am I hoarse! Those guys at Trek.fm are awesome though. Really nice. I had a lot of fun

EntAllat -- it's a podcast, so I think you can listen to it any time you want once they post it. I can't remember if they said they'd do it tomorrow or Tuesday, but as soon as I get details, I'll be sure to let you all know.

I tried to be nice, but considering the episode in question, it was a challenge at times!

[THE Rigil Kent]

That certainly sounds like a nearly impossible task ... coming up with something positive to say about that mess? Er ... uh ... well, I personally liked T'Pol's hair in it ... and ... um ... the closing monologue with Enterprise captains was cool ...

Okay. That's it. I'm done.

[ShannaG]

I haven't had a chance to listen to it yet, but here's a link to our TATV discussion, Let's Blame It On The Cabbage.

...which, incidentally, was almost named for a three-boobed cat.

[bluetiger]

I enjoyed the podcast very much, Shanna. It was great to hear your voice. I think you guys kept things civilized while still calling a spade a spade. There was so much wrong with TATV that one does not know where to begin. You were so correct about the characters all being off. Can you imagine Malcolm, Hoshi, and Travis not mentioning Trip's death or mourning him in any fashion.

The only scene that held any meaning for me was when T'Pol inhales Trip's scent from his folded uniform.

I loved the points you made about the lack of explanation as to how Trip and T'Pol went from holding hands in Terra Prime to being broken up six years later. (Lets all say Bonded)

You did a great job and thanks for the good words about the Expanse.

[EntAllat]

I finally got a chance to listen to this. Nicely done! I thought I'd heard all the various kinds of comments one could make on the failings of TATV, but there were a few new ones here for me.

I did like the one "positive" starter comment for the discussion and I agree with it. Had the series gone on, it would have been kind of neat to see a ENT/VOY episode and an ENT/TNG epsiode and a ENT/DS9 episode in the manner in which Brian(?) described - showing how events in ENT's era, and from these characters specifically, affected those other lives and characters. One per season, just stuck in the middle somewhere. It would have been a neat thing for a prequel series. But here, it was used in place of the finale and it didn't even work as the concept Brian described.

But mostly, I really liked the discussion focus of critique on the dramatic tension. It's true, there was nothing for the audience to really get into. Riker's personal quandary from some episode of TNG that I could hardly remember while I was watching this? Trip sacrificing himself so that Archer wouldn't be late to make a speech? (Oy.) Deanna gives away the moment early on so we know what's coming?

I loved your comment about "warp engines up on blocks". Yeah, that line about Trip never having gone to college really bugged me. REALLY bugged me. In a -"Seriously?? Is this what the writers think of an educated Southerner?"-kind of way. "You know you're a redneck engineer when..." LOL. Here's the thing: I suspect the line was included in an attempt to convey the idea that Trip was really smart - perhaps as a nod towards innovators and the many, many technical and programming geeks that are out there who never went to or finished college (or got a degree in something completed unrelated, like anthropology ) yet create complex technology - BUT, like a lot of what they intended in TATV, it just did not come across that way.

I also agree with you that Enterprise never got a proper finale. We tend to accept "Terra Prime" as such, but I liked your observation that it neatly wrapped up TnT, but not necessarily Enterprise. I hadn't thought of it that way before, and it's probably why there are so many fanfics out there that actually do provide that kind of closure. A good finale would have wrapped up the lives of each of the characters, and had more to do with the stakes involved in forming the Federation, and their role in that.

The only thing I didn't agree with was the "it was too early in the time line" with regards to letting TnT have a different ending that what was implied in TATV. But maybe that's because of my anthro perspective: Sarek belonged to an elite class of his culture - one that was constantly in the public eye. He and Amanda would have been the first high profile xeno-couple, but certainly not the first couple. Working class people, especially folks in the military and orgs that cross cultures, are usually the first. But they rarely make the news and if they do, they don't stay there. They drop out of the public eye very quickly once whatever major event made them famous is done and gone. I see TnT as that working-class sort of early cross-cultural couple. I think Archer would have sustained the public eye, becoming an Admiral and Statesman, especially if he involved himself in politics. But the rest of the crew could have easily dropped out of that public eye, intentionally or not, including TnT. B&B could have gone there, but they were too chicken to.

Great job! I wish we'd heard more from you!

[THE Rigil Kent]

Riker's personal quandary from some episode of TNG that I could hardly remember while I was watching this?

Interestingly enough, that TNG ep was one of the few TNG ones I remembered and the quandary made little sense to me (ignoring the radical differences in tone between the Riker & Troi characters.) Malcolm's earlier issues in season 4, what with his conflict about whether to tell Archer about his past with the Section, actually fit the Riker issue whereas I still haven't been able to quite figure out how the incident shown in this ep tracked with the Riker one...

[EntAllat]

Riker's personal quandary from some episode of TNG that I could hardly remember while I was watching this?

Interestingly enough, that TNG ep was one of the few TNG ones I remembered and the quandary made little sense to me (ignoring the radical differences in tone between the Riker & Troi characters.) Malcolm's earlier issues in season 4, what with his conflict about whether to tell Archer about his past with the Section, actually fit the Riker issue whereas I still haven't been able to quite figure out how the incident shown in this ep tracked with the Riker one...

Yes! I hadn't thought of that, but you're right. Malcolm's Section 31 quandry makes a lot more sense with regards to Riker's quandry.

[Honeybee]

TATV is given a place of - ahem - honor in this article:

How to Tell if A TV Series is not Going to End Well